W211 E320 CDI Auto g/box question.

Peter De La Mare

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Now, this may just be because I've never driven an Auto Diesel before, but I have noticed something on my mate's car that I'd like an experienced member to confirm for me.

When pulling away from standstill, depending on throttle position, the revs climb to 2k, or 2.5k, and appears to be slipping before the roadspeed matches the revs and it locks up and then acts 'normally' beyond this rev range and through the gears.

On my petrol E320 the revs don't climb anywhere near 2k and the torque convertor appears to lock up a lot earlier than the diesel equiv.

Is the described behaviour a feature of the diesel engine/gearbox characteristics, and quite different to the petrol engine, or is there possibly a problem with it?
 

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I cannot say I've noticed that on mine, is it the 5G or 7G box?
 
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Peter De La Mare

Peter De La Mare

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It's the 5 speed. The car is a 53 reg 2004 model Estate.
 

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Ok, I had the 5G box and IL6 previously and never noticed any slip on acceleration. Apply foot to and car would accelerate forward is my memory and it did it very smooth and fast if required.
There maybe something not quite right with the box, once some of the technical members see this they will no doubt be able to comment.
 

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Being a lower revving engine this is not right,,the first couple of changes should be near on instant
 

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mine does this a bit too. It has since new. Its far more pronounced in C rather than S mode and also more pronounced when cold but it does it all the time to some extent. I can't say whether its as high as 2200 rpm but the revs do jump and then wait for the car to catch up. I assume its to allow the turbo to spin up to peak torque rather than struggling at lower revs.
 

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...When pulling away from standstill, depending on throttle position, the revs climb to 2k, or 2.5k, and appears to be slipping before the roadspeed matches the revs and it locks up and then acts 'normally' beyond this rev range and through the gears.

My 2004 W211 E320 CDi (Avantgarde, 3.2 litre straight-six, 56,000 miles, 5-speed) does this. It happens in 1st & 2nd gear when pulling away from standstill with the engine & gearbox up to temperature (don't confuse 'slipping' with the gearbox holding higher revs when the engine is cold to bring the ATF up to temperature more quickly).

The impression that 1st & 2nd gears are slipping is quite apparent, and personally I don't like it. The symptons are much more obvious when light throttle is being used. Go for more of a 'boy-racer' launch, and the 'slipping' symptoms seem to disappear (along with the tread on the rear tyres!).

Maybe it has something to do with light throttle operation confusing the gearbox. Pulling out into traffic often requires the throttle to be backed-off shortly after pulling away, and this seems to make the 'slipping' even worse.

Is the described behaviour a feature of the diesel engine/gearbox characteristics, and quite different to the petrol engine, or is there possibly a problem with it?

I've sent my E320 CDi back to the main dealer twice to have this 'slipping problem' investigated, and both times the dealer has reported that the gearbox is performing correctly.

The ATF level is correct (right on 'max', in fact) and the gearbox has had a recent ATF and filter change.

In contrast, neither my Vauxhall Senator 3.0 (petrol) automatic, nor my wife's 2002 Vauxhall Zafira 2.2 (petrol) automatic exhibited these 'slipping' symptoms. In both cases, pulling away from standstill was instant and the gearchanges were smooth and precise.

This E320 CDi is my first oil-burner, so I have no previous diesel experience to make a comparison.

Razoo
 

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MB boxes do not feature a permanent lock up,,lockup only takes place through the changes,, this can be adapted on STAR my car does not do it,neither did the last one or almost any other that I have driven. I think that some MB guys are nervous at attempting this,,its all done on STAR
 
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Peter De La Mare

Peter De La Mare

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Razoo, Jberks,thanks very much for your detailed responses. This clears the matter up for me. It's a little disconcerting, especially as the diesel engine is obviously more vocal than the petrol and this feature seems to make it all the more apparent.
 

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Razoo, Jberks,thanks very much for your detailed responses.

You're welcome!

This clears the matter up for me.

Must admit, I remain concerned because it just doesn't seem right.

It's a little disconcerting, especially as the diesel engine is obviously more vocal than the petrol and this feature seems to make it all the more apparent.

I couldn't agree more. The symptoms conjure up visions of worn bands, replacement gearboxes and imminent bankruptcy :(

Razoo
 
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Peter De La Mare

Peter De La Mare

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Yup, I too feared exactly the same thing, and as I'm considering purchasing this vehicle I really would like to be convinced. :shock: Your experience with the main dealer somewhat reassured me, plus hearing from JBerks and other posters on other forums have calmed me a little.

I might just visit a dealer and test drive one, just to be sure though.:D
 

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I would do that Peter,,try another one
 

ALFIEBEARD

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Yup, I too feared exactly the same thing, and as I'm considering purchasing this vehicle I really would like to be convinced. :shock: Your experience with the main dealer somewhat reassured me, plus hearing from JBerks and other posters on other forums have calmed me a little.

I might just visit a dealer and test drive one, just to be sure though.:D

Hi Peter,
I have a w211 E270 CDI Auto and when cold produces the exact symtom you describe, I did write about it some time ago on here, it does this to get heat into the cats quickly, this usually is only noticable when cold, but I must say Merc boxes are totally different especially the diesels than say your average GM or Borg Warner box which locks up a lot quicker, dont forget these boxes are computer controlled and continually adapt to your driving style, personally I dont think that you have a problem and its just a characteristic of Merc Diesel boxes and their software settings, but this is only my opinion and no doubt if I am wrong I will be corrected(and rightly so);)

Alfie B
 

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Mine is the same. I wish it would hold onto each gear for a little longer, and change down a little more quickly.

On my old W124 I would give the kickdown cable a twist, anyone know if there is an adjustment on the 722.6 box?
 

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Mine is the same. I wish it would hold onto each gear for a little longer, and change down a little more quickly.

On my old W124 I would give the kickdown cable a twist, anyone know if there is an adjustment on the 722.6 box?

No such thing on this box
 

Razoo

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I have a w211 E270 CDI Auto and when cold produces the exact symtom you describe...

My E320 CDi gearbox holds on to the revs when cold, but this doesn't give the same impression of 'slipping'.

The impression of 'slipping' that I experience is when (gently) pulling away from standstill with the engine and gearbox fully up to temperature.

My local MB Main Dealer told me they did a thorough test of the gearbox functions, including a road test with a portable test device that gave readouts of the gearchanges (presumably rpm). They also did a glycol contamination test of the ATF (in case I had the French Valeo radiator problem). They found no problems.

Razoo
 

Razoo

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...I might just visit a dealer and test drive one, just to be sure though.:D

An excellent plan! Please report back on your findings.

Another test would be to drive the vehicle you are considering buying again, and try a few enthusiastic getaways to see if the hooligan approach causes the 'slipping' to seemingly disappear (like it does on mine).

Razoo
 

Razoo

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Mine is the same. I wish it would hold onto each gear for a little longer, and change down a little more quickly.

On my old W124 I would give the kickdown cable a twist, anyone know if there is an adjustment on the 722.6 box?

As TV says, there's no (manual) adjustment on these boxes.

There is (allegedly) a procedure that resets the adaptive gear settings back to factory default, although some people say it works, others say it is just a placebo effect.

Have a look at this thread: 722.6 Autobox Reset Procedure

Note that both ALFIEBEARD and myself posted the alleged reset procedure, and the two procedures are slightly different! Maybe one works, and the other doesn't ;)

ALFIEBEARD's procedure:

(1) switch OFF the climate control and radio.
(2) close ALL doors.
(3)Turn Ignition key to all dash lights ON position(not as far as start though)
(4) Press and hold the accelerator to the floor for 20 seconds.
(5)with Accelerator still to the floor, turn the key to the OFF position DONT REMOVE IT YET.
(6) Slowly lift your foot off the accelerator.
(7) Sit for 2 minutes DONT TOUCH ANY SWITCHES.
(8) Remove the ignition key and exit the car.
Razoo's procedure:

Applicable to Mercedes W211 E320 CDi (2003-2006)

Reset Adaptive Gearbox/Throttle Settings:

This ECU reset procedure only erases the ADAPTIVE transmission & throttle settings. It does not erase any of the fuel/timing or other programming.

1. Put the key into the ignition and turn it clockwise to position 1 (first position).
2. Press the throttle pedal to the floor and hold for five seconds.
3. Turn the ignition key anti-clockwise to position 0 (Off), then release the throttle pedal. DO NOT remove the ignition key.
4. Wait at least two minutes for ECU to reset.


You could try both procedures and see what you think.

Razoo
 
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Peter De La Mare

Peter De La Mare

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After driving another example I can confirm that it is indeed normal behaviour, and also is far less obvious when in Standard mode.

I'm going to try your reset procedure Razoo to see if there's any difference.
 

Wirral_guy

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I don't have the same car but my auto box and 270cdi engine does exactly the same. I could have sworn that I had asked the same question but I can't find it on here now. :(

To compare symptoms so to speak, I press the accelerator and the revs will jump to, say, 2500 and then the car gently accelerates to catch up with the revs. It only happens on gentle acceleration - if I boot it...whoosh :D.

If I could find my original thread, I am sure someone replied that it is a Mercedes auto box trait and very unlike other auto-boxes. It's a bit disconcerting as it feels like the box is slipping but I have got used to it now.

Dave
 


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