Tyres crabbing jumping in slow turns, plus rear wheels spin in any conditions with such a powerful car pulling away

[mimo38]

I just bought the S63 AMG V8 biturbo COUPE used with only 15000 miles 2017 model & one owner with almost new Pirelli zero tyres 255/45 & 285/45 ZR19" on standard AMG 10 spoke wheels & it is a 2 wheel drive model only available in the UK. The vehicle had been MOT`d & all wheels tracked (by myself)

It was crabbing ,jumping sideways on full lock moving fwd & reverse at any low speeds (yes I didn`t notice when I test drove it)
This was unbearable & I desperately needed to resolve the problem now in our winter so I can rest assured if it is resolved forever with cold tyres then it will be with warm tyres in summer time.

It also had another big issue having 900nm & 580 bhp that meant small amounts of wheel spin on any road conditions esp damp whilst turning from standstill and pulling away or at the lights pulling away. I was actually threading so carefully as to almost have no chance of promptly exiting side roads almost restricting the enjoyment having such a nice car.

NOW I am pleased to confirm after a couple of hours reading up & asking for advice & following recommendations I invested in brand new latest version MICHELIN SPORT summer tyres with the same sizes & all my problems are resolved YES no more crabbing, juddering sidewalls of front tyres & no more immediate wheelspins in pulling away even gently as it did before.

I cannot state enough how much the grip has improved from the rock hard Pirelli`s and also the comfort now in turning at slow speeds with no noises or judders in near full lock. For the record I was driving the car in comfort settings throughout the month I have owned it & now can easily drive it in all driving setting modes

 

[mioba]

Just reading the first para I was going to say Pirelli P zero tyres are pants, a very hard tryre and suggest getting them changed.
I had them on my W220 at first, loud and hard, Dunlop SP maxx rescued me there.

Glad you got them changed and all sorted, the right tyre for the respective car makes a hell of difference to the all round enjoyment of a car.

 

[A.J.]

Just reading the first para I was going to say Pirelli P zero tyres are pants, a very hard tyre and suggest getting them changed.
I had them on my W220 at first, loud and hard, Dunlop SP maxx rescued me there.

Glad you got them changed and all sorted, the right tyre for the respective car makes a hell of difference to the all round enjoyment of a car.

So are Michelin, in fact Michelin can be very slippery in poor conditions because of that so I am a little surprised at the OP's findings.

I spent over 40 years in the Vehicle Contract Hire industry and our findings from our data were that both Michelin and Pirelli were the hardest wearing tyres in the market place. They both were also very slippery in adverse conditions. The other problem we found was that the carcases often started to crack way before the tread depth was at a level that they needed replacing.

Because of the hard wearing characteristics of Michelin we insisted that any new vehicle we purchased was shod with Michelin.

 

[rorywquin]

So are Michelin, in fact Michelin can be very slippery in poor conditions because of that so I am a little surprised at the OP's findings.

I spent over 40 years in the Vehicle Contract Hire industry and our findings from our data were that both Michelin and Pirelli were the hardest wearing tyres in the market place. They both were also very slippery in adverse conditions. The other problem we found was that the carcases often started to crack way before the tread depth was at a level that they needed replacing.

Because of the hard wearing characteristics of Michelin we insisted that any new vehicle we purchased was shod with Michelin.

I’m no expert on tyres but my understanding is that there are various grades / qualities / compounds available for both the tyre bands you mention above?

Slightly off topic...

I read all the comments on performance and grip and do wonder if people have the driving skills and opportunity to push different tyre brands to the limits of their performance.

Is "Mr Average driver" really able to determine the difference in performance between top brands or is it more of a subjective assessment?

I’ve have PZeros on my R172 SLK350 and on my current ride and honestly cannot say if they are good or bad and I'm no slouch when it comes to driving. I’ve had the SL on a circular banked track at top speed, on the autobhan (several times) at top speed and also did about 20 laps in it on the Millbrook proving grounds race circuit. I do wonder if they swapped my tyres (without me know) if I’d notice the difference in my day to day driving.

 

[rf065]

NOW I am pleased to confirm after a couple of hours reading up & asking for advice & following recommendations I invested in brand new latest version MICHELIN SPORT summer tyres with the same sizes & all my problems are resolved YES no more crabbing, juddering sidewalls of front tyres & no more immediate wheelspins in pulling away even gently as it did before.

You may think you've resolved it, but putting new tyres on will usually stop the crabbing and juddering, until they start to wear down & then it will resurface.

 

[A.J.]

I’m no expert on tyres but my understanding is that there are various grades / qualities / compounds available for both the tyre bands you mention above?

Slightly off topic...

I read all the comments on performance and grip and do wonder if people have the driving skills and opportunity to push different tyre brands to the limits of their performance.

Is "Mr Average driver" really able to determine the difference in performance between top brands or is it more of a subjective assessment?

I’ve have PZeros on my R172 SLK350 and on my current ride and honestly cannot say if they are good or bad and I'm no slouch when it comes to driving. I’ve had the SL on a circular banked track at top speed, on the autobhan (several times) at top speed and also did about 20 laps in it on the Millbrook proving grounds race circuit. I do wonder if they swapped my tyres (without me know) if I’d notice the difference in my day to day driving.

I am a 'Mr Average Driver' and you are right, the difference between a premium tyre and a mid range tyre wouldn't make it's self evident. My main criteria is that the tyre is relatively quiet and has a good wear life. The tyres I inherited on my current MB are Nexen and quite frankly they do all that I require from a tyre. The car has now done 16,000 miles and there is still 5mm left on the tyre and they are quiet. Will I replace them with another set of Nexens, yes I will

 

[rorywquin]

I am a 'Mr Average Driver' and you are right, the difference between a premium tyre and a mid range tyre wouldn't make it's self evident. My main criteria is that the tyre is relatively quiet and has a good wear life. The tyres I inherited on my current MB are Nexen and quite frankly they do all that I require from a tyre. The car has now done 16,000 miles and there is still 5mm left on the tyre and they are quiet. Will I replace them with another set of Nexens, yes I will

Wasn’t having a dig at you .......

I’ve done about 18,000 miles on the original P Zeros on my car and they still have ~4mm on them and as I mentioned - I do push the car hard when I can.

 

[A.J.]

Wasn’t having a dig at you .......

I’ve done about 18,000 miles on the original P Zeros on my car and they still have ~4mm on them and as I mentioned - I do push the car hard when I can.

The thought hadn't crossed my mind Rory, I was just responding in agreement to your comments

 

[RhodieBill]

I get that "crabbing" you mention, but only in winter when it is below 6-7 degrees-C. I just don't turn full lock. Problem solved, and cheaper!

 

[Madtutle3]

Could your cars suffer from this steering design?

Akermann Effect

 

[RhodieBill]

Could your cars suffer from this steering design?

Akermann Effect

Yes, I've been aware of this for a few years now. It's because the Negative Camber increases on the Outside Wheel, (that's the wheel on the opposite side of the turn) If you get out and look you will easily see this, the opposite happens on the Inside Wheel, it will look canted over. (It's a peculiar Merc trait). It's just the way it is. You will always notice it when the weather has got colder and when you first use the car, ie Tyres are cold, like reversing out of your driveway and having to turn sharply.
In Summer it doesn't do it.
If it really bothers you that much reducing the prescribed Tyre Pressures can help. Failing that, buy a car that doesn't do it.

 

[onefortheroad]

Yes, I've been aware of this for a few years now. It's because the Negative Camber increases on the Outside Wheel, (that's the wheel on the opposite side of the turn) If you get out and look you will easily see this, the opposite happens on the Inside Wheel, it will look canted over. (It's a peculiar Merc trait). It's just the way it is. You will always notice it when the weather has got colder and when you first use the car, ie Tyres are cold, like reversing out of your driveway and having to turn sharply.
In Summer it doesn't do it.
If it really bothers you that much reducing the prescribed Tyre Pressures can help. Failing that, buy a car that doesn't do it.

Reincarnation, I've tried lowering tyre pressure, made it worse , I've now read to increase the tyre pressures to help with crabbing . Think I'm going down the route of another set of rims with winter tyres . This crabbing is started to p*SS me off tbh. If I'd known the GLC had this issue ,I'd of bought a BMW .

 

[mioba]

If I'd known the GLC had this issue ,I'd of bought a BMW .

Banned!

 

[Timeandleisure]

Reincarnation, I've tried lowering tyre pressure, made it worse , I've now read to increase the tyre pressures to help with crabbing . Think I'm going down the route of another set of rims with winter tyres . This crabbing is started to p*SS me off tbh. If I'd known the GLC had this issue ,I'd of bought a BMW .

Me too! I still can’t get used to it and it happens in all temperatures. I changed from run-flats and have Michelins too. I am sure this is not acceptable?

 

[onefortheroad]

Me too! I still can’t get used to it and it happens in all temperatures. I changed from run-flats and have Michelins too. I am sure this is not acceptable?

All season or. Winter tyres is the answer . Softer rubber . Or have the new type steering knuckles fitted .

Glc anyhow . E class maybe just needs tyres

Reinforced side walls make it worse.

 

[Timeandleisure]

All season or. Winter tyres is the answer . Softer rubber . Or have the new type steering knuckles fitted .

Glc anyhow . E class maybe just needs tyres

Reinforced side walls make it worse.

Thank you

 

[brandwooddixon]

My newly acquired S63 Coupe doesn't suffer from crabbing on turns, nor indecent wheelspin on moving away. in fact, I was expecting more of an issue when pulling away. Admittedly I drive it in Comfort - sorry, "Controlled Efficiency Mode" - but it seems well mannered and turns in well. Triggering the traction control, can of course be induced at any legal speed in the UK if heavy footed.

Currently fitted with BF Goodrich at the front and Michelin Pilot Sports at the rear.

From experience I'll probably replace these with ContiSportContact 6 or 7 when they wear out, as they worked well on my W216 giving a good balance of longevity with grip. I once tried Michelin Super Sports which gripped like the proverbial to a blanket, but wore out in about 6k miles!

 

[onefortheroad]

My newly acquired S63 Coupe doesn't suffer from crabbing on turns, nor indecent wheelspin on moving away. in fact, I was expecting more of an issue when pulling away. Admittedly I drive it in Comfort - sorry, "Controlled Efficiency Mode" - but it seems well mannered and turns in well. Triggering the traction control, can of course be induced at any legal speed in the UK if heavy footed.

Currently fitted with BF Goodrich at the front and Michelin Pilot Sports at the rear.

From experience I'll probably replace these with ContiSportContact 6 or 7 when they wear out, as they worked well on my W216 giving a good balance of longevity with grip. I once tried Michelin Super Sports which gripped like the proverbial to a blanket, but wore out in about 6k miles!

Probably down to bf Goodrich that it doesn't crab. ?????

 

[Srdl]

Reincarnation, I've tried lowering tyre pressure, made it worse , I've now read to increase the tyre pressures to help with crabbing . Think I'm going down the route of another set of rims with winter tyres . This crabbing is started to p*SS me off tbh. If I'd known the GLC had this issue ,I'd of bought a BMW .

Michelin Cross Climates cured mine and they seem to be wearing very well after 7,000 miles

 

[ajlsl600]

What ever happened with tyres 20 Yr ago 40k km was not out of question.