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Views upon ECU remapping and brabus chip

Discussion in 'General Mercedes-Benz Related Discussion' started by David-Butter, Jan 17, 2010.

  1. Retired

    Retired Senior Member

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    Seems to me that most of the discussion, even if wanders about a bit, is triggered by the claims and assertions made by the sellers of these products.

    They claim increased horsepower and torque figures. No problem with this it’s clearly true.

    They claim the potential for improved economy, presumably if you don’t use the increased performance. Happy to believe this although clearly a contentious point.

    They claim the re-map is undetectable. Just not true.

    They claim, well GCL do, that manufacturers have no right to void warranty claims pertaining to components affected by the remap. They quote Block Exemption in support of this position. This is not true, their own arguments are frankly silly claiming on one hand that the component (ECU program ) is the same and on the other that they will return it to the original spec if required.

    GCL claim to offer a warranty that protects against the manufacturer voiding the warranty. The wording of this warranty on the GCL site is barely in English.

    I’ve looked the warranty offered by another tuner, can’t remember which one, and it excluded components failing due to manufacturing faults and failing due to wear and tear. Hard to see what’s left as a reason for failure.

    I’d like to hear from someone who has made a claim on one of these warranties or has the full policy wording which they are willing to post..

    GCL, apparently, tweak the gearbox ( went out for a test run with Tony and we tweeked the gear box for prime shifting ). Can only surmise that this means driving hard to get the gearbox to adopt a more aggressive shift pattern, which will only last while the aggressive driving continues. Strike me as sales / marketing bs.

    I don’t have anything against remapping. It works and there are good products out there, Go and get it done if you want to. Just don’t believe all the rubbish to do with warranties, detectability etc.
     
  2. hawk20

    hawk20 Senior Member

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    Seems a shame if some wish to ferment discord when there is no real cause for it. Reading back through this thread I can find not one person who believes that chips/remaps don’t work.

    Truth is we all know they do work. Check out the 320cdi against the 280cdi or the newer 350cdi against the 300cdi and we can all see the scientifically measured power and torque figures showing the big power differences which are largely due to different mapping.

    Check too the numerous articles in reputable car mags –some even using scientific rolling road tests- that independently verify extra power from chipping/remapping.

    Secondly, few will doubt that engines can be mapped to give better fuel economy See the pre-facelift A160cdi which does 65 mpg or so with an engine that was the same (apart from mapping) as the A180cdi which does far fewer miles per gallon.

    Nor I imagine do many dispute the huge evidence that humans are susceptible to a placebo effect- give 100 people Aspirin and 100 others chalk pills and quite a large percentage of those with the duff pills will report a wonderful reduction in their pain levels. Hence the need to be a bit sceptical about non scientific individual tests without proper independent back-up.

    Since most of the heat appears to come from those who see themselves in the pro-chip/remap camp could they try to accept that almost all of us agree the major points above?

    So what is in dispute? On the previous thread a company claimed to offer more power and 15% better fuel economy. A massive claim which I for one, and many others, took leave to be sceptical about until some independent testing could be shown to support it. None has yet been forthcoming.

    That claim has not yet been an issue on this thread. Only some doubts about the guarantee position (still not resolved), and the claim that the remap had led to a reduction in revs when at cruising speed. Not a big deal and surely not worth getting steamed up about.
     
  3. stumpy

    stumpy Senior Member

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    To muddy the waters further still I was told by MB that if you factory order a car with the Brabus chip you enjoy the full warranty, but retrofit one to a brand new car and you have limited cover of 60k miles.
     
  4. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    It is not a case of doubt,,it just cannot happen
     
  5. OP
    David-Butter

    David-Butter Senior Member

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    Utter rubbish,


    Im sorry to say but its true ive seen this with my very own eyes ! Its black and white.

    GCL Tuning will cover any part damaged that is affected by the remapping


    To be honest im not botherd if they dont pay ( There T&C's state they will ) But even if they dont i could go and get the map removed and go to another dealer and start over and get it fixed.


    Economy is improved by remapping ( Brim to Brim ) 3-4 MPG better PROVEN

    The gearbox was tweeked while i was drving to give a different feel ie hard or smooth.


    Quote

    "I’ve looked the warranty offered by another tuner, can’t remember which one, and it excluded components failing due to manufacturing faults and failing due to wear and tear. Hard to see what’s left as a reason for failure"


    How can you expect ware and tear to be coverd?

    How do you expect manufacturing fault to be coverd?

    Q
    What left well to cover

    A
    Everything you current warranty offers!

    "Just don’t believe all the rubbish to do with warranties, detectability"

    More rubbish its in black and white and this has all been said before at the start of this post.


    Once again why do you not just get the FACTS in the first place?




    Summery

    Im Living proof that the following are ture

    - GCL warranty will cover (seen the policy)
    - Remapping for economy dose give more economy (mayby not as much as stated but more never the less)
    - Gearbox remapping works
    - Remapping gives much better performance





    Sorry for being so brief just eating launch and sending from the iphone (a little tricky)








     
  6. whitenemesis

    whitenemesis Senior Member

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  7. Alfie

    Alfie Forum Supporter Authorised Forum Supporter

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    Can with a CVT gearbox.
     
  8. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    We are not talking about chipped A class cars are we
     
  9. whitenemesis

    whitenemesis Senior Member

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    No but it does raise the awareness that generalisations can be very misleading.

    Even on the 5 speed auto'box there are variations in operations, as implied by the MB doc you referenced.

    It's just worth keeping in mind?
     
  10. st4

    st4 Banned

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  11. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    Indeed there are,,but only a tiny amount,you cannot change this through tuning
     
  12. whitenemesis

    whitenemesis Senior Member

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    A change in wind direction could give that difference! Is it really worth chasing?
     
  13. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    The problem is here that if you are enjoying your extra power, you will be using it,,so any gain will not be seen.

    I can drive my SL in a normal fashion and get X MPG,,enjoying the power, then I could halve the figure
     
  14. Alex Crow

    Alex Crow Senior Member

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    remap threads always go this way, don't they?
     
  15. st4

    st4 Banned

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    Probably no, and perhaps you are right, I would say a 10-15% gain is definately worth chasing, even if its only 3-4mpg.

    I sometimes only get 36mpg on way to work if its cold, sometimes 40mpg if warmer and traffic lighter, but I always strive on that journey for every fraction of 1mpg I can gain. Not for the money, but because I want to.

    I will eagerly await more posts from the OP re his cars MPG.
     
  16. *Thumper

    *Thumper Banned

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    Each re-map thread is upto 15% better than the last ......... and a lot more powerfull, in it's argument ................ :rolleyes:
     
  17. Alex M Grieve

    Alex M Grieve Senior Member

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    Less so than it used to be. My Rover 105s driven at 90 mph into wind gave 30 mpg, whereas the return journey gave 30 mpg (the length of the M6 in the late 1960s.)

    Aerodynamics have improved hugely, but as Peter says, it still makes a big difference.
     
  18. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    Well if MB go to the trouble to make my car go lower the fast you go, there must be something in it
     
  19. whitenemesis

    whitenemesis Senior Member

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    You got those mpg's right, Alex?

    In my first car, Imp, (before modifying) if the wind blew head-on it was like some one pulled the handbrake on!!

    But my point was the stated gains could easily be a result of driving conditions.
     
  20. television

    television Always remembered RIP

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    Have to agree that driving conditions do come into it, ,from here to London and back my figures can vary by 3 PMG, and that is quite a lot when you are in the mid 20's band
     

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